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海外华人里谁的英语最牛(2) 2017-08-27 05:32:51

After discussion with Pascal and Mr.Yu, I sense that probably the following was all agreed upon:

================

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What Kind of an Artwork Can Turn into an Instant Classic - On Hu Jie 's Famine Themed Woodblock Prints

2017-03-06 Shui Hao

A Historical Survey of Hu Jie 's Well Renowned Woodblock Printing on the Famine Theme

The famine related thematic woodblock printing created by Hu Jie herewith consists of three major sections: "Let There be Light ", "We" and " Reform Through Labor " respectively. 

If you have been unaware of the magnitude scales of the Great Famine perceptually in contemporary China, it would be advisable to take a deep breath to calm down yourself before unfolding this album of the Famine Themed Prints by Hu Jie, for the ensuing visual sensation would engulf you instantly with excruciating and gut-wrenching experience. Undoubtedly, if your heart had already started throbbing uncontrollably at merely browsing the work, it would be a sign of the work of art like this one that is summoning up the reawakening of your inherent sense of humanity deep down in your heart. Moreover / Furthermore / In addition, you may even be able to discern the cruelty of life and of the social system, though it cannot be deemed as your own contribution to the fight against evil of any kind. Perhaps, you still revel in awaiting others to eliminate all the injustice in life so that you might be able to entertain the liberty to shed tears with your colleagues on the realities of the famine or compose a sorrowful message on Wechat at your leisure.(… it is a sign of art echoing the call of your humanity reawakened. Furthermore, if you also sensed the crudity of life and of the social system, it still cannot count as your contribution to the fight against evil. Perhaps you still await others to eliminate all the injustice in life so that you might be able to entertain the liberty to shed tears with your colleagues on the famine theme or compose a message on Wechat).


(OK - so far so good)

Art, not only results in those effects. Hu Jie's art of famine, the thematic woodcut, aims to express more. We need more imagination to examine Chinese's ability to act, to find a new truth, to comprehend the art revealed by the sense of common human dignity which must depend on the underlying system to protect its security and content. No empty talk or fiction allowed.


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作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-30 04:24:13

"用来转移焦点、转移尴尬、插科打岔,是不会有任何效果的,句号" - you got me wrong. My purpose here is to prove that even word or language in general itself is relative and can be invented by anyone as it is not like math, as long as you can convince people what you did makes sense, that's all.

回复 | 0
作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-30 04:15:24

There is no UG (Chomsky). You were somehow affected by that idea which you might not even hear of though. For example, in Chinese there is NO grammar at all in the past: 香稻啜余鹦鹉粒碧梧栖老凤凰枝 - you don't need grammar to know it, correct? Mainland China taught English like this which indeed ruins English study there - this is how I feel.

回复 | 0
作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-30 03:41:07

"What do you think my dog? Smart?" - any problem?

回复 | 0
作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-29 23:48:10

Language is something of a collective habit or agreement which therefore there is no absolutely correct or wrong.

1. 世间一切,都是情有可原。前面一篇,刚刚列举了只言片语中4宗瑕疵纰漏,有点儿没面子。所以,撸胳膊、卷袖子,一定要反唇相讥,据理反驳一下。不料想,唉,越辩越不白净。

第一句,就是 错 加 错 :

A. which 作为前述 Language 的代词,以倒装主语形式引导后面的从句,等于是 there is so and so in the language。 Mind you,please, which 前面倘若缺失了 in,从句与主句就无法连接起来!重复一遍: which 前面的介词 in, 隐匿到哪里去了呢?

B. There is / There are 后面罗列的只能是名词 / 名词从句,怎么竟然摆上了副词修饰的形容词, eh ?!

With all due respect, Hare博,脑子里本想说英语语言里就没有绝对正确、绝对错误一说,结果转换成英文,就成了

纵然你走遍地角天涯、问遍地球76亿革命人民,都会亿夫所指这么一条英文超级简单陈述句 ------ categorically wrong, wrong, wrong 绝对、绝对、绝对 错!错!错!

绝对正确的,应该怎么表示呢?

There is no absolutely correct or wrong answer in the language.

There is no categorical correctness or wrongness in the language.

这回,句子倒是通顺,语法倒是正确,含义却绝对大错特错!错得不能再错!!! 回头再看前述四项基本错误,哪一项、哪一条可以公之于众、广告天下、平反昭雪、恢复名誉??

2. For example, think something or think of something both exist in daily usage with slightly different shade of meaning.

shade 是可数名词,slightly 前面的不定冠词 a,哪里去了?? 又是一错, 长叹一声,唉!

think something or think of something both exist 要多错,有多错!前面说 或者这个,或者那个,紧跟着说 二者都是 ...... 到底想捡一样说,还是两样合在一起说, eh ?? 怎么压根儿没想过,把那个 or 换成 and 呢? 前矛后盾,真是 文字表述、内在逻辑的满目疮痍。

think something or think of something both exist 要多错,有多错!前面说 或者这个,或者那个,紧跟着说 二者都是 ...... 到底想捡一样说,还是两样合在一起说, eh ?? 怎么压根儿没想过,把那个 or 换成 and 呢? 前矛后盾,真是 文字表述、内在逻辑的满目疮痍。

With all due respect , Hare博,眼神儿有点儿不挤,脑筋有点儿不够清爽,概念层次有点儿迷瞪,Hare博的原话是:

What do you think next paragraph ?

What do you think next paragraph ?

What do you think next paragraph ?

重要箴言要重复三遍! 是 What 引导的一般现在时态疑问句里的动词 think 后面、宾语前面,一定要有介词 of / about ...,而根本不是什么动了手脚、经过偷换概念、改换门庭、用在陈述句里的 think !!! 这两种使用场景,区别大了去了!!

3. "Instancology" 好,学习了。放在谷歌栏目里搜索,wow, 满目皆是。但,用来转移焦点、转移尴尬、插科打岔,是不会有任何效果的,句号。

回复 | 0
作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-29 20:23:44

I feel you treat language as math and they are not the same. Language is something of a collective habit or agreement which therefore there is no absolutely correct or wrong. For example, think something or think of something both exist in daily usage with slightly different shade of meaning. Another example is, say, the word "Instancology" must be of a new vocabulary for you, but not for me - because? You guessed it, it is my fancy creation. So there is often more than one way to express one's self. FYR.

回复 | 0
作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-29 17:08:55

以前的寥寥英文数语,早早就有感觉、发现,这是第一次实在按捺不住进一言:

抬手就码出来的,往往内含自然流露、不加细琢、却看不下去的词句纰漏:

feel 专属情态动词,后面只能跟形容词,永远不能跟 reservation 之类的名词。

只能是 have / hold / keep ... reservation(s), feel reserved ...

I summarized yours combined with mine 两个动作之间,要有 and 连接;

What do you think next paragraph ? think 后面的 of 哪里去了?

没有注意过 What do you make of it ? 的用法?

to put at front 错在哪里?

Which is correct?I stood at/in front of the bus stop.

I stood at/in front of the building.

I had a seat in front of the classroom?

Answers

"At THE front of..." Implies that the position is part of, and at the very front

of, something.

EX: She stood at the front of the line. (She is part of the line)

EX: The hood (bonnet) is at the front of the car. (It is part of the car)

EX: I had a seat at the front of the class. (I am part of the class)

"In front of..." Implies a different position, separate, not part of.

EX: I stood in front of the building. (I am separate from the building)

EX: The teacher stood in front of the class. (The teacher is separate and

facing the class of students)

AT is the right choice for: "I stood at the bus stop"

It's always "at the front of". You need "the".

in front of = facing; before; opposite (sometimes)

at the front of = the foremost position

...... ...... ......

回复 | 0
作者:Pascal 回复 hare 留言时间:2017-08-29 16:41:41

以前的寥寥英文数语,早早就有感觉、发现,这是第一次实在按捺不住进一言:

抬手就码出来的,往往内含自然流露、看不下去的词句纰漏:

feel 隶属情态动词,后面只能跟形容词,永远不能跟 reservation 之类的名词。

只能是 have / hold / keep reservation(s), feel reserved ...

I summarized yours combined with mine 两个动作之间,要有 and 连接;

What do you think next paragraph ? think 后面的 of 哪里去了?

没有注意过 What do you make of it ? 的用法?

...... ...... ......

回复 | 0
作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-29 15:55:45

If I feel reservation, I would keep both translations and re-consider them later on. Keep going pls...

回复 | 0
作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-29 14:29:19

Mr. Yu's use of "turn" here is more idiomatic, good job!

回复 | 0
作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-29 14:17:32

作者: 俞先生 留言时间: 2017-08-28 13:54:35

你写的里面有 becomes an instant classic 这样的句子。这个句子有问

题。问题出在那个 become 的动词。应该改成 turns。然后,写作

His artwork turns an instant classic。你的看法呢?

1. Lawler vs MacDonald Becomes an Instant Classic

2. "THE MIRACLE OF MEDINAH’ BECOMES AN INSTANT CLASSIC

3. Injustice 2 Becomes A "Instant Classic" For Fighting Game Fans

4. Astor Gold™ Becomes An Instant Classic

5. Super Chefs: a New Event Becomes an Instant Classic

6. USA-Russia becomes an instant classic

7. Chaotic Summer Slam main event becomes an instant classic.

8. American Graffiti becomes an instant classic

9. Bike race for everyone becomes an instant classic

10. Lutzenkirchen’s play becomes an instant classic

1. Rockets, Warriors 2OT thriller turns into an instant classic

2. She Straight Up Turned This Sad Song Into An Instant Salsa Classic

3. Blowout turns into an instant classic; Cape survives Yarmouth

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作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-29 13:07:24

当然,如果你已经有止不住的眼泪,这算得上 性勃发与艺术召唤的 次合作;甚 ,你还读出生活与制度的严酷,但这也不是对抗争邪恶做出的贡献。也许,你企图等别 摆平 活中的 切不公, 然后可以继续与同仁们在饥荒史实中流下同情的眼泪,或者写出一箴哀怨的微信。

Undoubtedly / Apparently / Obviously / Naturally (Of course 原意语气重,很不礼貌文雅, 忌用), if your heart has already started throbbing uncontrollably at the sight of what you see, it would be a sign of the work of art like this one that is summoning up the reawakening of your inherent sense of humanity deep down in your heart. Moreover / Furthermore / In addition, you may even be able to discern the cruelty of life and of the social system, though it cannot be deemed as your own contribution to the fight against evil of any kind. Perhaps, you still revel in awaiting ( for 错! 动词 await 后面永远没有 for !! ) others to settle up / get rid of / eliminate all the injustice in life so that you might be able to entertain the liberty to shed tears with your colleagues on the realities of the famine or compose a sorrowful message on Wechat at ( your ) leisure.

看看 started throbbing uncontrollably 可以细致地形容什么?

I knew and she knew that by the way my dick was throbbing and pulsating, there ... At that very moment, my dick started throbbing uncontrollably, and the come ...

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作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-29 09:04:14

If you have been unaware of the magnitude scales of the Great Famine perceptually in contemporary China, it would be advisable for you to take a deep breath before opening ( 删去 you, 换用动名词 opening,显得简练;再说,前面已经出现过一次 you, 再 you 一次,又重复、又啰嗦)this album of the Famine Themed Prints by Hu Jie, for the ensuing visual sensation would engulf you instantly / simmeringly by a kind of gut-wrenching, soul-searching experience.

If you had been 本想用虚拟句式的 had ,用在这里,不对。

还是学用人家学术性质的标准短语 ------ the magnitude scales of 已经省略了前面的 intensity.

to render yourself gut wrenching 词义、句法不通。

inhale 原义 吸入,还是原来常用的 take a deep breath 好。

engulf 和 overwhelm 是近义词,二者只选其一。双重使用,多余。overwhelm someone 后面常用的介词 with ; engulf someone 后面介词惯用 by.

instantly 用在这里,意思是不是过了? 过于夸张? 容易引发读者逆反心理? 换成 simmeringly 等等、等等类似近义词,或者 ......

回复 | 1
作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-29 04:47:34

A lot of excellent points made in your editing, I summarized yours combined with mine, here is the following result for your reference:

=====================================

If you had been unaware of the magnitude of the Great Famine perceptually in contemporary China, it would be advisable to inhale fully before you open this album of the Famine Themed Prints by Hu Jie, for the ensuing visual sensation would engulf you instantly which would make you feel so overwhelmed as to render yourself gut wrenching.

回复 | 0
作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-28 23:39:36

如果你对当代中国的大饥荒(没?)有足够的身心感知,在掀开李正天饥荒版画之前,最好先深呼吸,平静一下。惊心动魄的视觉就要来临, 马上裂变成凌迟似地痛,搅翻你的心肺。

第一句中文, 似为前后逻辑上的语病,是不是少了一个“没”字?

If you kind of feel lack of adequate perception of the magnitude scales of the Great Famine in contemporary China / If you have been well aware of the Great Famine in contemporary China, it is advisable ( for you 凡是括号里的词句,均为选择性质的可要、可不要 ) to take a deep breath to calm yourself down before opening this album of the Famine Themed Prints by Li Zhengtian and finding yourself overwhelmed with an imminent heart-stirring / hair-raising visual sense that is about to split up into a gut-wrenching experience of turning your heart and mind upside down.

Note:

Famine Intensity and Magnitude Scales: A Proposal for an

Instrumental Definition of Famine

First published: 23 November 2004

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作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-28 03:09:32

I will keep your view in mind, let's move on. What do you think next paragraph ?

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作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-27 20:01:32

万维博客留言框里的功能,糟糕、劣质无比! 无论输入什么字号、字体,全都显示、变成这等唧唧索索的德行 !!

无论你怎么远远地隔出英文行距来,显示的,都是这疙瘩一坨!

再查看网页上的这两句:

Sculpture / Collage Lessons for Kids

Sculpture is 3-d artwork created by shaping or combining materials.

If I am working with children of six or older who have never made three-dimensional artwork, I find it helpful to have them start with a simple sculpture that can be formed in their hands without setting the clay on the table as they work.

原来,小孩子们用胶泥、彩纸、塑料部件 ...... 揉捏、拼装的歪七扭八手工品,统称为 artwork! 而正儿八经、流芳百世的艺术珍品,才被郑重称之为 A Work of Art。

这一重大区别,在上一篇的下面留言中抄录 Wikipedia 里有关 Work of Art 的解说中,看不出来。只有母语人士或者接触过这方面的人,才有认知。

Wikipedia: A work of art, artwork, art piece, piece of art or art object is an aesthetic physical item or artistic creation. Apart from "work of art", which may be used of any work regarded as art in its widest sense, including works from literature and music, these terms apply principally to tangible, portable forms of visual art: ...

简言之,artwork 可以泛指艺术品,亦可以指

孩子们使用胶泥捏咕出来歪歪扭扭的手工品;

而 a work of art , 没有任何例外,一定是专

指艺术作品!

我们只能创造这样的 Chinglish 呈献给世界:

We two who and who? : 我们俩谁跟谁

You ask me, me ask who; 你问我,我问谁

No Zuo No Die 不作不死

我们原创人家现有英语词句的精准定义? 使不得。

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作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-27 19:34:34

谢 Hare 博好意! Hare 博也来 phishing 钓鱼执法?Just kidding. 署名?用不着,使不得。不是顺口一说,真的是纯属练习而已。能对于 Hare 博的文字,有一点点、一词一句提示性的协助,就是胜利。

上一篇留言中说过,英语是人家使用1,000多年的语言,其每一条精准、内含不同 nuance 细微差别的英文定义,我们篡改、干涉、自攒、自纂、编造不得,只能马首是瞻。

这一篇下面的上一次留言中也说过,“ ...... 稍一轻敌,就是错 ”。这两句话,Hare博想必是看到了,却没有往心里去。 所以,就有了:

Comparing "a work of art" and "artwork", the former is sort of recognization while the latter the final art product which implies well- thought-of, artistic desgin, maturity, etc., just a reminder.

请逐词、逐句细细品味英语为母语女士的这一段解说:

When you say a work of art in English you are generally referring to a painting, music that you admire and that was created by an artist or at least has some artistic talent.Art work does not have to refer to work that was performed by an artist ...For example: -This painting is truly a work of art (ie you admire this painting)-In school this morning my children did art work (and unless it is very artistic you would not say "work of art")I hope this helps.Jrico, Aug 8, 2007

再查看网页上的这两段:

Sculpture/Collage Lessons for Kids

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作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-27 13:47:20

Comparing "a work of art" and "artwork", the former is sort of recognization while the latter the final art product which implies well- thought-of, artistic desgin, maturity, etc., just a reminder.

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作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-27 13:21:05

Pascal, you might send me your real name afterwards to put at front as a translator too for Mr. Hu Jie's artwork. Your contribution must be recognized indeed. Again, many thanks.

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作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-27 13:00:13

I like the two words you selected: "renowned", "on" the theme.

You are correct on "both to be agreed upon" too, which is not part of the translation though, so my grammar ran loose...

回复 | 0
作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-27 12:48:43

刚刚注意到,作者名为 帅好,Shuai Hao, 不是谁好、睡好、水好 的

Shui Hao !

英文字母的码字,是一种很 exquisite 的活儿,稍一轻敌,就是错! 很是需要 being meticulous, fastidious and scrupulous.

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作者:Pascal 留言时间:2017-08-27 12:27:26

Hare 博感觉很对,标题着实欠妥,极易引发看官们的反感、不屑:上赶子凑上前去的,岂不是成了冒充文学青年的装X犯?昨天Hare博说得好,不过是练习一下,而已。

南来客眼尖,这一句口吻委婉一点儿,不妨延伸、展开一下为:

... the following might be agreed upon by both sides /

... the both parties might agree upon the following:

1. What Kind of Art Work Can Become an Instant Classic - On Hu Jie 's Famine themed Woodblock Prints

原文强调的格调,不见了; 艺术作品 Artwork, 是合为一体的、可数名词 ,所以前面须有不定冠词 An. Artwork 这个合成词,看上去很像中文顺序,作为标题,有点儿土,换成这样,更显艺术一点:

What Kind of A Work of Art Can Become an Instant / Everlasting / Enduring Classic ----- ... Themed 第一个字母 T 大写

2. 2017-03-06 Shui Hao ------ 成了中文顺序,人放第一位,时间置后:

By Shui Hao March 6, 2017

3. A Historical Survey of Hu Jie 's Well Known Woodblock Printing of famine theme

A. " Well-Known " 有点儿一般般,太常见;换成 “ Well-Renowned ” 似乎雅致一点点?

有人问,已经 renowned 的了,前面再加 well, 是不是啰嗦的废话?

从事长达35年之久文字编辑、出版工作的 Robert Charles Lee 回答说:

不一定! 人家就是要强调再强调:不是一般的名气很大,而是名气大到如雷贯到实际上人世间每一位看官的耳朵里:

Not necessarily. Broadly speaking, "renowned" on its own is enough in most practical cases (this restaurant is renowned for its fine cuisine).Sometimes "well-renowned" has to be used in order to emphasise the fame that it's not only famous but famous enough to practically everybody. It operates better when you're also adding something extra (this restaurant, already well-renowned for its fine cuisine, is also famous for its decor).

B. of Famine Theme 中的介词 of 不妥,总是使用 with 或者 on 引导可数名词 theme。

所以, A Historical Survey of Hu Jie 's Well-Renowned Woodblock Printing on the Theme of a Famine

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作者:南来客 回复 hare 留言时间:2017-08-27 07:48:31

谢答复。

说的是英文表达。

中文版只有帅好(Shuai Hao)。

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作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-27 07:24:52

For reference:

http://chinainperspective.com/ArtShow.aspx?AID=80882

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作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-27 06:51:33

Shui Hao is a well known artist in China, a friend of Hu Jie's and wrote the introduction for next year's internation exibit planned.

Look at the first version, we talked about translation to some extent

Hope this helps

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作者:南来客 留言时间:2017-08-27 06:43:00

不敢说有什么真才实学,请教两个问题:

..the following is both agreed....什么意思?

Shui Hao 是谁?

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作者:hare 留言时间:2017-08-27 06:15:24

我只希望有真才实学的讨论,天桥下来的同学请绕行,虽然题目也许耸人听闻

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